If they just farm the chickens like they do in Indiana there would be less of this nonsense. I have lived in Indiana my whole life and my husband dose land surveying for lots of farms. Most animals out hear have a large area to roam. Even the chickens. I have never seen a farm with small cages like those on the animal abuse you tube video’s. Not even once in Indiana. Think about why would a farmer in his right mind want his live stock to die or be in poor health. You get more product from a healthy happy animal then a sickly animal.

Rebecca- you’re talking about a hobby farm. Modern agriculture is not “old mcdonald’s farm”.  No modern farmer would would want there animals exposed to the elements, predators, parasites and disease.  Science has proven a climate-controlled environment, with artificial lights is the most humane for an animal, if it was not, then there is not a farmer on earth that would invest millions on such facilities. Just would not make financial sense to invest in something that doesn’t have the animals best interest in mind. @ Humane watch- I cringe when reading the quote that Temple Grandin is a “animal welfare expert” .  She was an animal behavioral scientist who’s main focus was beef cattle in range settings.  She is completely out of touch with modern ag. in other species.  The AR groups use her to make claims.  She is also among the uninformed that “ole’ mcdonald’s farm” is the modern way.  I urge caution when using her in a discussion outside of the handling of beef cattle.

I am what you would call a hobby farmer. Raise chickens for the eggs. I don’t allow my chickens to run free because if I did I wouldn’t have any chickens before long. The hawks and eagles pick them off daily and they don’t stop until they’re all gone.

If someone would get them about 50 hens or so and put them in a pen with a hen house and see how many eggs get broke or are so nasty they can’t be cleaned due to hens fighting over nests, multiple hens laying in one nest because they seem to always want the same nest, hens laying in the floor or in the dirt in the pen.

It might actually make some sense to them then why 15,000 chickens running free is not a good idea if you depend on making a living off of eggs.

When food is sky high due to more and more stupid laws and regulations and little kids and the elderly are going hungry will it be worth it?
Do people honestly care this much about a chicken or is it more it’s the in thing to care about?

I don’t know but it seems that if all egg producers refused to sell any eggs to California at all, that a collective California eye may be opened as to who really has the clout in the food industry.  Imagine all those restaurants that would be furious!  Would the egg industry be harmed?  Yes, on the short term.  Would egg prices go up because of it? Yes, on the short term.  Would HSUS be happy? Yes, on the short term until Californians who actually animal based protein decided enough was enough and rolled out Proposition 3000 to oust the whole darn issue.

Shelly, I wasn’t saying hobby farming is “bad,” just pointing out that it isn’t the modern, most humane way.  People argue that a “cage-free” egg is more nutritionally sound, yet don’t consider the sanitation challenges you’ve mentioned, nor have they even thought about it. Driving past one of the numerous Amish farms in Indiana does not give one a true sense of modern ag., lacking electric powered ventilation and feeding systems require old ways.  Shelly, you know why our home raised food(I raise my own as well) promotes a healthier lifestyle? Because of all the hard work and “exercise” required to produce it! We both can attest to that!

I’m with John Galt on this!  Of course no chocolate cake or ice-cream from outside Calif till they catch on!!

Some people do actually care about the welfare of chickens. I live on a hobby farm in Oklahoma where we get all our eggs and beef from our animals.My chickens are some of the most intriguing animals on our farm and there is a whole group of people in the U.S. who enjoy them. (See magazines like Hobby Farm and Backyard Poultry).

Caring about how we as humans treat and control animals that have the capacity to feel pain is an important issue. Cramped industrial farms where chickens have to be on antibiotics in order to survive are certainly not the answer to this issue. I agree that not all Americans can get their eggs from their own farm and that there is a necessity to have some form of mass production but I think there is a compromise here that can benefit both us and the animals we are exploiting.

Livvy,

The sad fact is you cannot compromise with those people, they have nothing to give up with a compromise (that very word means you both have something to give up) but true animal welfare people are the only ones with something to give up.  If you attempt to give “something” to them (and they do not understand animals and how some have specific needs for their own safety) they never stop, its the camels nose under the tent, he comes right on in when that happens and then there are no animals left!

Temple Grandin also said that because chickens are flock animals, they are likely to touch wings no matter what the cage size or kind of housing they’re provided with.

This morning’s Today show had a segment about the egg farms that are under investigation. Interestingly, one highly emphasized point was the presence of insects and rodents in the hen houses. If you turn the hens out into a pasture,  aren’t they going to be exposed to more insects, rodents and other animals that might roam through the pasture? 

billybob has it right ” No modern farmer would would want their animals exposed to the elements, predators, parasites and disease.  Science has proven a climate-controlled environment, with artificial lights is the most humane for an animal,” 

And I have cared for a flock of chickens and the eggs are nasty when they roam freely, as is the lot unless you have a huge space for them to “graze”.

I agree with Shelly. Free range is a mess. In every way. They poop everywhere, get into everything, eat everything, lay their eggs whereever, and everything wants a bite of chicken or egg.

They’re as bad as the raccoons with the garbage. They’ve even eaten the paper off of the cans. And yes, I make sure they eat right. Scratch grains and pellets, food scraps when we have them, dog and cat food they snatch from the respective animals, plus ‘grazing’ of over 2 acres.

I’ve seen them actively hunt down moles and mice. Was watching several of my girls tilting their heads so their earholes were parallel to the ground. Oddest thing to watch, suddenly my Rhode Island scratched the ground with all her might while my Easter Egger grabbed something mouse sized and ran. She’d caught a mole. Ended up eating it too. Which makes me cringe with this salmonella scare.

My hens also tend to bunch. They’re never far from each other, enriched cages sound good to me rather than battery.

I’m also confused by the free range. Free range isn’t free range, there are two types to my knowledge. One is a huge open area inside a barn where chickens are allowed to roam. No grass, just feed stations and water troughs. Then there’s the hobby farm type free range. Open spaces, lots of predators and grass.

The hobby isn’t efficient at all. All it takes is one dog or one coon to wipe out a flock. I almost had that happen this year with one female coon. Over 37 chickens dead in less than 3 days. Caged them and she still managed to rip them, horror movie style, through the pen. Heavy duty chainlink with mesh underneath, supercoon still got through.

Barn free-range doesn’t seem safe to me. Chickens tend to cluster and pile. Meaning birds will literally climb on top of one another. Guess what happens? Crushed and smothered under your peers’ weights.

One way to combat this is to keep like sized chickens. Yet if you get a number of chickens piling on, even Goliath the chicken will be crushed, even if the others are dwarfs. Another way is to reduce the number in the pen.

What we need are more people who are willing to be farmers in America and Europe! Not enough people want to be farmers and so the existing farmers have to implement inhumane methods in order to affordably produce what the population demands!

Its amazing what happens when we put smart minds like Temple Grandin’s to the task of finding ways to make large (and small) scale animal agriculture more humane AND productive at the same time.  You do not need to sacrifice one for the other, and when the animals are well cared for it results in financial as well as “warm-fuzzy” profits for the owners and caretakers. 

HSUS and the like are forcing us to believe you can have one OR the other, and usually neither if they can have their way. We need more smart people to stand up and demonstrate that you can have your (cheese)cake and eat it too.

Most of the comments given are excellent.  However, Livvy is completely incorrect stating that antibiotics are routinely fed.  That is NOT TRUE.  If an antibiotic has to be given, eggs or meat are NOT put into our food supply until the antibiotics are completely out of the animals’ system so that NO antibiotic gets into the food supply.

One more point-Billybob is correct to say that Temple Grandin should NOT be placed upon a pedestal and “worshiped” as the ultimate animal welfare expert. She is human and can make mistakes or have personal opinions cloud judgment the same as the rest of us.  She doesn’t make a living on income from farming, does not feed/water/clean-up after animals, and has no concept of the value of a farmers’ time…all of which need to be considered aside from animal behaviors.  I am not saying she is wrong-but her ideals should not have overpowering authority-most farmers are truly in “tune” with their livestock and are fully aware of the natural animal behaviors just as much as Temple Grandin.  With farmers’ incomes completely at the mercy of the market price, they have to balance ALL aspects of livestock production.

Katherine, where do you get we have to implement INHUMANE practices????  I believe that is completely inaccurate!

We have a small acreage which affords us the luxury of raising our chickens outdoors, free-range style.  They are protected from predators and are extremely healthy and happy chickens.  Because they have room to roam and enjoy plenty of sunlight, they are parasite-free, and produce a highly nutritious egg higher in protein and less cholesterol than a traditional store bought egg.

I agree not everyone can afford to do this, but because we have the space to do so and prefer to know what we’re eating, this works for us.

If those complaining about inhumane conditions for chickens would adopt a couple of chicks and raise them to hens and take care of them every day and feed them and collect eggs, then they could have the type of egg they are looking to eat.

Because until there is a worldwide shift to treat all food animals as humanely as everyone wants them to be treated, this is the only choice.

The Green Maven,

They don’t want you to HAVE them, they want them GONE, NO EGGS, NO CHICKENS, YOU should be VEGAN, no meat, no leather, no wool, no fishing, no hunting…GOT IT?

Mary Lou you forgot THEY don’t want you to have pets either…..

Green Maven must live in Utopia…with NO Coyotes….Antarctica?

billybob said “Science has proven a climate-controlled environment, with artificial lights is the most humane for an animal”

Doesn’t your own intelligence tell you how absolutely ridiculous your statement is? The most humane living conditions for any living creature is fresh air and sunshine. Longer life be damned living in a bubble is no life at all.

And stop referring to mom and pop farms as hobbies. I occasionally shop them for locally grown organic produce and grass fed beef and can tell you their farms are their sole source of income. They are professional farmers.

When I referred to the farm I live on as “hobby” I meant it as such. My parents are both physicians and do not depend on their farm as their sole source of income. For them it is just that, a hobby that they keep up because they enjoy having grass fed beef and free range chickens. Some people do have actual hobby farms that are solely meant to supplement their own diet and not for commercial farming.

Also, animals in feed lots are routinely fed antibiotic food. Beef in the feedlot stage are given antibiotic additives to the corn-based meal (cows are NOT meant to eat corn, they are grazers) in order to switch them from grass to corn without horribly disrupting their digestive systems. So you see, these animals are NOT suffering from any sort of disease that warrants the use of antibiotics, rather suffering from our intrusions into their natural diet.

I’ve recently become vegan for personal reasons but I can’t seem to reconcile the humane issue regarding eggs. The comments above are intriguing and I am pondering the points made regarding cage-free eggs and free-roaming chickens. What about Vital Farms Eggs? How are their farms run? I only know as much as they advertise. I’m just starting a shift in diet and don’t want to put my kids risk for malnutrition so they are still eating eggs - from Vital Farms. Eventually, I would like to raise a few chickens because I have always loved the animals and would plan to keep them until the end of their lives weather or not they laid eggs. But chickens will only lay eggs for a certain amount of time, so if a hobby farmer/backyard farmer raises their chickens for eggs, what is the humane outcome for non-laying chickens?